Please use better analogies. Your’s are elementary at best and contribute nothing constructive to the discussion.

Good point, Anne. I think that the reason that the democracies we are trying to start in places like Iraq are failing is because Americans have a solid principle of the separation of church and state, while in places like Iraq the thinking is different. Their society values religion as an important part of government. That’s why Iraq’s democratically elected legislature can’t get anything done, because everyone voted based on religion, not politics. That’s why their political parties are not based on conservatism and liberalism, but rather on Sunni or Shi’a or Kurd. So as much as we’d like it to, I don’t think that our form of government could succeed in Iraq, at least not right now, because these people will not accept one of the fundamental aspects of democracies — separation of church and state.

When we export democracy to other parts of the globe, the often overlooked key componant is the separation of church and state – or in the case of communism – ideology and state. When those issues are not separate from government, usually all persons not affiliated with the presiding religion or ideology are inadequately represented.

Democracies also make better donuts.

I’m just responding to your first assertion that “Religious extremism in all it’s forms is the greatest threat to world peace we face.” If you are referring to this current moment in history I would agree with you, with the distinction that it’s really Islamic extremism that’s the threat to world peace at this moment. There aren’t too many Christians, Buddhists or Jews beheading and blowing up people to spread their religious ideas these days. If you are talking within all of history, the other major religions have all had their periods of wreaking havoc and committing atrocities in the name of their god, but it that would be factually inaccurate to state that religious extremism had been the greatest threat to world peace. The secularists and atheists win that contest hands down. And again, it wasn’t the secularism of societies that have made them good or bad (Stalin’s Russia was secular) but the democratic process or the absence thereof. Regardless as to whether you prefer donuts or bagels, it is true that atheism was one of the major principles of Communism and that can’t be dismissed in this discussion.

Faith is belief, not truth.

But you can believe whatever you want. Hence Christians, Muslims, Jews, Wiccans and all the rest of the religious panoplea. They all just believe whatever they want to believe.

That disconnection from actual truth makes religion the most pure evil that exists. Because any belief, no matter how horrible, (all people who don’t worship some white guy named “jesus” are sinners and the devil’s work, say) becomes your “truth” and justifies your doing whatever you want in its name.

My own belief is that all the religious people in the world should be put somewhere to fight it out amongst themselves (Greenland seems like a good choice – lots of water and fish).

And the rest of us people who don’t want to constantly fight all the time over imaginary “gods” can start work trying to repair the world from the damage religious people have done.

That’s my fervently held faith, a just as valid and “true” as anyone else’s. I pray every day it may come to pass. Can I hear an “Amen!”…

Hey, who needs nuance or critical thinking? That’s, like, too much work, dude. Simplicity rules!